why plead guilty?

[kskc]

it was the start of my husband's trial today, i was being called as a witness for the prosecution. right before i sent in foot into the court the arrestin detective called me to say my husband has changed his plea to guilty because of the advice of his barrister.
but with all the evidence we had against the girl who made the accusation eg. cctv, phone bills, changes in her statements and her fathers etc, why did his barristers tell him to change his plea?
do they just not want to work on the case? now we have to wait 4 weeks for sentencing. he's the one that told me to fight, everyone else i knew just wanted me to leave him.

i can't fight anymore. i have lost the only piece of happiness i had left.

there's no point fighting, i am really sorry to say this but there's no way anyone falsely accused can win. i am sorry for everyone.

[Rights Fighter]

There are several reasons as to why he changed his plea to guilty:

Despite the evidence you say that was weighed against the complainant, the barrister advised him to plead guilty - this is called a "cracked trial" so the barrister would not have made much money - so it cannot be said that he gave that advice to get more money.

1. Counsel might have had a more pressing engagement to attend hence the advice - but hubby would not have been forced to plead guilty with a gun to his head. He still had the choice and opportunity to fight.
2. It is possible that hubby is innocent but plea bargained to get a lighter sentence
3. It is possible that the weight of the evidence against the complainant was actually not that great and the verdict would probably have been guilty
4. You won't like this but.........he could be guilty

You have not lost the only bit of happiness you had. It might seem like that but you have no idea what is around the next corner for you.

Go to the doctor to see if you can be prescribed a short course of anti-depressants. Spend time with friends. Pamper yourself with warm baths and scented candles.

You have had months of worry - take some "me" time.

[kskc]

why plead guilty?

hey RF, thanks for replying i knew you were the only one who would be able to give me some real answers.
you are definitely right but hubby is definitely not guilty. to be honest he got scared into agreeing in to changing his plea, his barrister said once the girl takes the stand the judge and jury will believe her and would be pointless to carry on with the trial as they would only believe her and if he changes his plea now he would get a shorter sentence.

i don't understand why didn't his barrister tell him to plead guilty at the beginning? at the earliest possible chance?

he got told maybe he'll get a 2year sentence, but he's already been in custody about 7months so it will only be a couple of more months.

i dont know. knowing the luck we've had so far it will most likely be more.

anti depressants have only helped my sleeping patterns, i still feel really low. i've started lashing out at myself again. things are bad, very bad. i feel incredibly depressed.

[Rights Fighter]

Remind me what the charges were and what he pleaded guilty to (they could be different if he's accepted a plea bargain).

Here comes the bad news - if he left it to the start of trial before changing his plea then he is not going to get much, if any credit for the guilty plea so he might not get much, if any knocked off the sentence.

This is because the cost to the tax payer for the court to be made ready and witnesses brought to court, plus all the relevant legal costs will be brought into the equation.

The judge might also say that the complainant has gone through the trauma of actually attending court when that could have been spared had the guilty plea been made earlier.

So don't be too surprised if the sentence is longer than you have been told.

Keep coming back here just for a chat as I am sure others will sympathise.

[Unregistered]

I don't understand why the barrister things the girl will be believed over your husband unless the barrister believes the girl?

[frankgallagherwasere]

If there bargains are supposed to be illegal why do they do it or is it there just not recognised by the court and judge ? I will never understand why people accept them when innocent YET one of my best m8s inside did exactly that as his Barrister said he could get 7 yrs IPP and taking a deal probably get only a couple and no IPP HE GOT 2.5 with IPP and no he did not do it (the accusation) BUT wanted to get out ASAP and that was his motivation. He did accept some of it BUT not all and certainly not the violence being suggested he isnt that type as his history showed.

Unfortunately these deals smudge the true figures of those innocent and thats their purpose and the defence as now I realise are too weak to argue your case - or simply not interested. The not to surprising thing is real criminals sack the Barrister when they offer deals ON THE SPOT which is ofcourse why the rules have now been changed.

The Judicial is just one big con except for the very few honest ones amoungst them of which yours truely RF has to be one of those on the top table EVEN IF she does think and believe me to be absoutley mad and bonkers. Yes I know Im a pain in the ass,

[kskc]

If there bargains are supposed to be illegal why do they do it or is it there just not recognised by the court and judge ? I will never understand why people accept them when innocent YET one of my best m8s inside did exactly that as his Barrister said he could get 7 yrs IPP and taking a deal probably get only a couple and no IPP HE GOT 2.5 with IPP and no he did not do it (the accusation) BUT wanted to get out ASAP and that was his motivation. He did accept some of it BUT not all and certainly not the violence being suggested he isnt that type as his history showed.

Unfortunately these deals smudge the true figures of those innocent and thats their purpose and the defence as now I realise are too weak to argue your case - or simply not interested. The not to surprising thing is real criminals sack the Barrister when they offer deals ON THE SPOT which is ofcourse why the rules have now been changed.

The Judicial is just one big con except for the very few honest ones amoungst them of which yours truely RF has to be one of those on the top table EVEN IF she does think and believe me to be absoutley mad and bonkers. Yes I know Im a pain in the ass,

i didn't know these bargain pleas were illegal....

i think my hubby's barrister just couldn't be bothered. the prosecution have agreed to drop one of the charges against him in the plea bargain. but the charge that is still against him could still get him put away for about 3years.

i just don't understand why his barrister wanted hubby the change his plea on the day of the trial. he's lost 6 months now. 6 months wasted.

RF is one in a million, i tell her all the time! anybody who reads this.... she's the one to talk to when u need advice. she definitely knows her stuff.

[frankgallagherwasere]

I think there should be an epetition to Parliament to have a new Saint and that should replace George Saint Helga the Great !! and what they call it Paintensaint of "Fighting for Justice".

2 things about deals, the charges are still recorded and it does not include a judge so anything can and sometimes does happen later on as he is not party to it. They tried it on me and it didnt set me in a good mood for the trial - its like when will they get it into their thick skulls I DIDNT DO IT !!

Im not lying they are !! read their full statements and you would see I was telling the truth. But ofcourse since the Police CPS and Barristers couldnt care less especially about justice and the truth, then one is doomed to oblivion. Dont care what anyone says British Justice is a career to many criminals not just some of the their clients, trials are a joke as no one asks the right questions to the right people half the time.

Accuser - did you lie to the Police - of course not

Accused - they said they didnt lie so you must have OK guilty !!

erm what eh? The fact is many accusations are no different to bullying in the playground and thats NEVER considered. Ours started when 2 kids got banned from our house and turned into a group feud resulting in our house being completely trashed and us convicted of bogus sexual assulat charges again one of their sisters and her friends - ofcourse with full Police and state protection.

Not that anyone cared to investigate that either - motives not allowed like what???!!! what chance have you

[kskc]

me and hubby are completely screwed.
he has no chance of coming home.
i give up.

[frankgallagherwasere]

its hard to put into sensible words whats currently happening, your damned if and when you do take deals and damned when you dont - the outcome can for many just be the same and some who maintain innocence FAR WORSE even.

The fact is many convicted and those who dont get justice for the crime are in a similar position - let down by the state, one has to ask is it that difficult to get things right? The problem is manipulation of transcripts, keep to facts and then the truth might be easier to establish and try and do a thorough investigation of people and circumstances and backgrounds.

However the biggest issue is what is a crime, an accusation or event, the laws are so open to abuse its sometimes impossible to seperate the two and with the trials being a sham on both crown and defence sides, is it any wonder the justice system is such a mess.

The convictions hardly touch the true figures and many of those convited are wrong, so there is little justice for anyone except those who deliver it as they get paid and thats all they care about (in most cases atleast there are some exceptions I know).

[Rights Fighter]

Can you not see FG that your ranting has not helped this lady? You have no idea what happened in her hubby's case and what happened in yours has no bearing on her hubby's as there are completely different.

kskc you know where I am if you need to chat. Hubby and you are not completely screwed just yet and it may not be anything like as bad you you think it will be.

[frankgallagherwasere]

Why dont people post their experience and how others delt with these people to try and resolve their issues, cant people talk anymore or mediate or is it their simply not allowed and the the system isnt interested?

The whole idea of punishment and rehabilitiation is to try and get people to stand up for their actions and sort out their problems? They keep telling us many are simply ill, cant they just fix them? Like why or how does one prove their ok when the system simply can't be bothered to listen to their views.

Oh yes and ofcourse the innocent, well yes the system simply cant cope with anyone who dares to say its all a lie, even when there isnt any evidence except someones hearsay, I know that one all too well.

I agree RF ranting dont help anyone, its the moral support and guidance people seek, its advice on what to do where and to whom, its about providing answers to questions and trying somehow to find a solution and atleast try and fix the problems they face.

No one ever said it was easy, but trying is better than just hoping it will all go away.

[friday]

hi kskc, life is sometimes unbearably difficult, i know i have become the most cynical person ever because of all the court stuff. sometimes we get fed up and don't see the point in fighting anymore but you have to keep fighting because otherwise you are letting other people win, be it the legal system, accusser, rapist. however long your husband is away for, you can't allow yourself to be in a mental prison caused by this false accusser.

i don't know anything about you so suggestions may not be appropriate for you. but here are a few things that helped me:
-not obsessively reading laws and legal stuff in the hope of somehow finding the thing that will mean he is free. it will almost certainly drive you mad.
-listening to music that puts some fighting spirit back into you (i don't believe in making my own justice but 'vengeance' by new model army definitely makes me want to keep fighting)
-reading poetry/short stories (if you like them) is a lot easier than trying to concentrate on a novel when you are feeling depressed.
-sunlight is amazing for adding hope to desperate situations so lucky the sun is finally coming out.
-make sure you eat properly. not eating properly can make depression worse.
-don't be afraid to ask for help (from dr, friends, support groups etc). the strongest people are those who are willing to admit their weaknesses.

[Rights Fighter]

Thanks Friday - your advice is actually very helpful to me as well

[friday]

thats good to hear

another thing im finding helpful at the moment is setting goals, ranging from walking to the shop and washing my hair (i struggle to get out of bed some days) to getting my degree (i have an offer just have to get the grades) to having my poetry published (thats a very long term goal!). i dont know why but it seems to really put the current ****ty situation in perspective.